I've got a real question, but maybe someone can tell me first which is proper ... "valve control" or "control valve"? Anyway, I sold one to a gentleman who now says "I finally got my tractor back together and find that now I have no hydraulics other than power steering. The only part involving hydraulics that was changed was this control valve". I assume it matters how/which direction the unit is installed. Would it be possible to install improperly and produce the issue he's having? Thanks, Bryan.
318 Power Steering Valve Control Install ...
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I could be way off base,and probably shouldn't even comment on this topic,but it sounds to me like he has his "power beyond" and his "return"lines crossed.I would assume that if this happened,you would have power to the implements when the steering is held at full lock and dumps pressure.Then again,maybe not.LOL
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First off it is a valve unit used to control, that makes it a control valve. John Deere in the parts section calls it a power steering control valve.
Go to JDparts.com and look up the steering unit on the parts diagram. That will help in tracing what hoses are hooked up where. There are two steering control valves bases on serial number: (S.N. 222001-285000) and (S.N. 285001-999000) (S.N. 010001-120000).
There are four ports near the bottom of the steering. One line comes from the hydrostatic transmission below where the drive shaft mounts. I believe it is the tractors top left port. The bottom two ports go to the steering first through hard lines then connecting to hydraulic hoses. The top right port goes to the oil cooler and then hack to the hydrostatic transmission.
Use the diagram in John Deere parts for your tractor and I bet you will find it.
Go to JDparts.com and look up the steering unit on the parts diagram. That will help in tracing what hoses are hooked up where. There are two steering control valves bases on serial number: (S.N. 222001-285000) and (S.N. 285001-999000) (S.N. 010001-120000).
There are four ports near the bottom of the steering. One line comes from the hydrostatic transmission below where the drive shaft mounts. I believe it is the tractors top left port. The bottom two ports go to the steering first through hard lines then connecting to hydraulic hoses. The top right port goes to the oil cooler and then hack to the hydrostatic transmission.
Use the diagram in John Deere parts for your tractor and I bet you will find it.
Doug ... thanks for clearing that up. I don't know why I didn't mention, but this is a 5-port control valve from a 1991 318 sn: M00318X100546. Nevertheless, I think the same general questions apply ... Can you install into the frame in the wrong position (are the bolts wider on top or bottom thereby demanding it be installed in only one position)? Is the internal design such that it makes a difference how things are hooked up? I assume so, just don't know what really happens inside there. Lastly, would a particular orientation produce the described results ... steering works, but hydraulics don't. Thanks.
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i picked this picture from a google search.It looks to me like switching #1 and #3 will get the results you describe.
http://public.fotki.com/blazbk/john-deere-tractor/john-deere-317-hydr-1/dscn8624.html#media
http://public.fotki.com/blazbk/john-deere-tractor/john-deere-317-hydr-1/dscn8624.html#media
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Bryan, you asked: "Is the internal design such that it makes a difference how things are hooked up?"
The answer is definitely YES. You have one problem already. Another could be if you turn the steering wheel right and the wheels turn left or turn left and the wheels turn right. If you install it in the wrong orientation then it would be harder hooking it up.
Look at this post from 2011, http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/335/161894.html
Bob Knight is putting power steering on a 317. But you should find it helpful for yours.
If your ports are marked they should have an "IN","OUT","AUX","LEFT" and "RIGHT" ports.
"IN" comes from the charge pump on the hydrostatic transmission.
"OUT" goes to the oil cooler and back to the transmission.
"AUX" connects to the bottom of the hydraulic control valve for the deck and other attachments.
"LEFT" goes to the rear of the hydraulic steering cylinder.
'RIGHT' goes to the front of the hydraulic steering cylinder.
I would check the "IN", "OUT", and "AUX". I believe two of them are wrong.
The answer is definitely YES. You have one problem already. Another could be if you turn the steering wheel right and the wheels turn left or turn left and the wheels turn right. If you install it in the wrong orientation then it would be harder hooking it up.
Look at this post from 2011, http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/335/161894.html
Bob Knight is putting power steering on a 317. But you should find it helpful for yours.
If your ports are marked they should have an "IN","OUT","AUX","LEFT" and "RIGHT" ports.
"IN" comes from the charge pump on the hydrostatic transmission.
"OUT" goes to the oil cooler and back to the transmission.
"AUX" connects to the bottom of the hydraulic control valve for the deck and other attachments.
"LEFT" goes to the rear of the hydraulic steering cylinder.
'RIGHT' goes to the front of the hydraulic steering cylinder.
I would check the "IN", "OUT", and "AUX". I believe two of them are wrong.
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I won't take that bet. I believe I would lose.
Thanks for the feedback & the links guys ... always been curious what the inside of this unit looked like. I'm going to forward this link to him ... see if it helps. I know it's pretty "cramped" in/around there and would think it very difficult to hook anything back up incorrectly. Let me ask this ... would it be possible to hook up correctly and lose/not have the hydraulics at all due to "wear and tear", bad seals, or anything else? I would think you'd get something, even if 'weak'. Thanks.
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In your first post you say: it "The only part involving hydraulics that was changed was this control valve". If this is true and I have no reason not to believe it, then the other hydraulic functions should continue as before. Normally you notice first that the deck starts dropping over short periods of time and gets progressively worse. Or it takes longer to raise an implement.
You didn't say why he was changing out the steering valve. That might help as lack of pressure from the charge pump might be the real cause of all of this. Is there any reason to suspect the charge pump?
You didn't say why he was changing out the steering valve. That might help as lack of pressure from the charge pump might be the real cause of all of this. Is there any reason to suspect the charge pump?
Doug ... His complete comment to me was "I finally got my tractor back together after having problem finding other parts, and find that now I have no hydraulics other than power steering. The only part involving hydraulics that was changed was this control valve, since I stripped one of the nipples on the old one, which was working fine." I don't see any indication that the charge pump would be an issue. I'm trying to determine if it's in any way possible to lose all hydraulic function if the control valve is installed correctly, whether it's bad/tired or not. If that's not possible ... if he should see some hydraulic response ... then I don't know what else to conclude other than that he wants to return for some other reason than that it is defective. It worked fine for me (no leakage or any other problems) what little bit I ran it ... came off a tractor I picked up with a broken rod (would run to load on & off a trailer). I'm hesitant to take it back as I can't just drop into a tractor to test out ... too cold out and don't have a tractor available ... and now I have to question his story. I hadn't asked what other parts he had a "problem finding". Thanks for the help.
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I think I misunderstood what you mean by "hydraulic function". You are saying that the two levers on the left have no response. You are correct that the charge pump is working because it wouldn't have power steering if it had failed. You have two control valves that operate off the pressure of the charge pump. Yours is set up so that if steering is needed, the steering control valve gets priority and hydraulic control valve gets very little.
My 1983 318 works the opposite. If I am lifting my deck or tiller, then the power steering is lacking and its very hard to turn.
I am wondering if he reversed the hoses on the hydraulic control valve. This could cause no hydraulics because there is an internal valve which is one way and holds the pressure to a set level so the power goes to the hydraulic lever that you move to raise or lower the deck. If you hook this backward then no pressure is getting to the levers on the hydraulic control valve, it is essentially a dead end for the fluid.
My 1983 318 works the opposite. If I am lifting my deck or tiller, then the power steering is lacking and its very hard to turn.
I am wondering if he reversed the hoses on the hydraulic control valve. This could cause no hydraulics because there is an internal valve which is one way and holds the pressure to a set level so the power goes to the hydraulic lever that you move to raise or lower the deck. If you hook this backward then no pressure is getting to the levers on the hydraulic control valve, it is essentially a dead end for the fluid.
Doug ... I got email confirmation from my buyer that "loss of hydraulic function" meant no response from front ports or rear lift cylinder when operating the 2 hydraulic levers. Both hoses/lines would need to be a flexible hose and not metal tubing to even make possible the reversing of the hoses on the hydraulic control valve, correct?
Can anyone tell me what's included with a rebuild kit, or have the part number?
Thanks, Bryan.
Can anyone tell me what's included with a rebuild kit, or have the part number?
Thanks, Bryan.
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No hydraulic function as the buyer describes it means that no fluid is going in. Either hoses weren't hooked up or the steering unit is bad. Anything is possible. He could have them reversed as there isn't much distance between some of the connections.
Can he just take the bottom off and switch it to get good nipples on his unit. That bottom plate should just switch. BUT be very careful.
As for as rebuild kits:
5 ports
AM100320 Kit 1 285001 - 595888 (SUB AM107762)
AM107762 Kit 1 595889 - NLA but JDParts shows it at $380.29
A new steering unit from John Deere shows price to be $1,051.05
Can he just take the bottom off and switch it to get good nipples on his unit. That bottom plate should just switch. BUT be very careful.
As for as rebuild kits:
5 ports
AM100320 Kit 1 285001 - 595888 (SUB AM107762)
AM107762 Kit 1 595889 - NLA but JDParts shows it at $380.29
A new steering unit from John Deere shows price to be $1,051.05
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