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Discussion Starter #1
I haggled my way into a decent 430 that hasn't ran for about 3 years. Troubleshot the wiring down and got it to run for about 30 seconds, lots of black smoke and RPM was a little out of control. I shut it off then replaced all the fuel lines(for small pin hole leaks), checked the tank, put a new fuel filter on, and followed the air bleed procedures from the manual. I get good fuel flow from the filter bleed and from the screw on the banjo bolt at the injector pump. When I go to crack the fuel lines at the ******s I get nothing, no pressure, no air, no diesel. I back tracked to the top of injector pump and get nothing out of the pump even with the lines fully disconnected. The shut off solenoid snaps back hard and holds the whole time. Electric fuel pump has been tested and works great.

I'm not too familiar with the operation of the injector pump but I've seen some things in the CTM3 about pulling apart the 3 fittings on the top and making sure O rings and such are in good working order. Can anyone explain to me how the fuel shutoff slide operates internal to the injector pump? Any other pieces of advice or am I stuck with needing to track down a replacement injector pump now?

--Dave
 

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If it ran for 30 seconds I hope the injector pump is fine. Does it show any signs of rust? I bought a 430 that did not run and water had been run through then injector pump, hard lines, and injectors. I replaced all of them.

There is an inspection plate in the housing that the injector pump nests in. If you take it off you will see the the slide. It's from the governor and you should be able to move it with your finger from left to right. There is a cotter pin that holds the slide arm in from the governor. If you have to pull the pump you remove the pin, take off the slide, and pull it out after taking off the 4 nuts on top.

If there is no sign of rust on the pump and the slide moves ok, I think your pump is fine. Replacing it is not easy because you will have to re-shim it if you get a different pump. Plus they are spendy.

It is a pain in the tail to get 430s going again after you replace the fuel filter - even harder replacing all of the things you did. It just takes a lot of cranking. Verify the hard lines are not corroded and hook them back up to the injector pump and snug them down per spec. I would then crank it some with the throttle all the way up until you get fuel out of the hard lines. It's going to take a few minutes. Once you get fuel out of the hard lines hook them back up to the injectors and be prepared for more cranking.

Jut be patient and let your starter cool down between cranking. Feel free to email me at [email protected] if you have more questions. Here is a picture of the pump I had to replace. 0729152229.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Now that you mention rust, yes there was rusty colored fluid that came out when I blew compressed air through the lines.


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Dave, I would make sure that the shut off was going all the way bag by actually seeing if you could push it farther and see if the tractor will start. You mentioned that you had a wiring issue, may not be getting correct signal to the shut off?
 

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put all full throttle when cranking, at idle there is only a small amount of fuel and takes a long time to purge it

if there was rust in the fuel lines on the pump, that could be bad

fuel shutoff solenoid slide the fuel rail to not allow fuel, it will still puff smoke some times but not enough to start it up

I have used a bungee cord on the solenoid and pulled it to the steering tower to get mine running before
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thanks all for the information. Next time I get out to the shop I'll try those things and provide an update. The wiring issue was a bad fuse at the fuse block that had shorted out one of the two power feeds. Has anyone opened up an injection pump and cleaned it out or is it not worth the nightmare?


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If an injection pump is removed it must be re shimmed even if its not replaced.

I replaced the crush collars and orings on my 430 and it took 2.5 charges of the battery over 2 days to re fire it. That was mid winter and it fired like a champ at -10 -20 all winter. All others are a rough start at those temps. Crank for 60 seconds max then walk away 30 minutes


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I don't think you can open up the pump. I think your asking for problems if you try and do too many things at once. How do the injectors look? Any rust on them?

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Dave, that rusty colored fluid that you blew out - was it before or after the injection pump? If before, that doesn't augur well for the pump because it doesn't take much unclean fuel to ruin the tolerances. If after the pump, then at most you're looking at injectors which is not as bad.
But in any case, blow clean diesel through everything to fully flush it, and then just try it. You may have dodged a bullet - only one way to know. I just rebuilt the injection system on my Cat D2 and I liberally flushed clean diesel through everything after boiling the components (not the injector pumps or valves) at the machine shop, using the wire brush, compressed air to clean any loose crud out. Probably a gallon all told - you won't need as much but don't spare the horses.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
It was after the pump in the hard lines to the ******s. I'll definitely flush everything and try again. Just seems strange to me that I get nothing out of the pump with the hard lines completely removed and I crank the starter for 30 seconds at a time. Yet I get strong flow from the bleed screw coming from the electric pump. Sounds like it just takes a while of cranking to get the pump bled and air out all the way to the ******s.


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It was after the pump in the hard lines to the ******s. I'll definitely flush everything and try again. Just seems strange to me that I get nothing out of the pump with the hard lines completely removed and I crank the starter for 30 seconds at a time. Yet I get strong flow from the bleed screw coming from the electric pump. Sounds like it just takes a while of cranking to get the pump bled and air out all the way to the ******s.


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I think you've got the idea. You can check if you get any output at the pump end of the steel lines. The volume of each pump is unbelievably small. So if it's purging any air it will take forever.


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What you can do is "pre-charge" the components a little bit e.g. take the pump to injector lines off, tip some clean diesel into the top of the three pump outlets, turn the injector lines upside down and fill them with diesel, and then quickly refit the injector lines at the pump and the injector to minimize loss. The diesel in those lines represents quite a while of runtime so the more you can get it filled up, the less cranking time it will take before it's bled.
Do ensure that you have followed each bleeding step in sequence, with the pre-charge above being the last (undocumented : ) step, to minimize the cranking time.
 

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After fighting a nasty lung infection and pneumonia the past two weeks finally felt strong enough to dig back into this. Crank crank crank for about an hour total off and on allowing the starter to cool. I finally got bubbles at one injector but nothing at the other two. Before doing this I pulled off the fuel shot off solenoid and the inspection plate where the cotter pin is for the fuel shut off slide. I get very little movement in the fuel shut off slide. Maybe 1/32". Barely moves. Is this normal? Just keep cranking til I get there? Tried priming the lines, just got diesel all over the shop floor. Get good flow from the lift pump, first bleed port by the fuel filter bleeds good, bleed screw at the injector pump bleeds good.


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have you re-opening the bleeder screw during the 1 hr this process took? that may set you back to starting over on the bleed process
 

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have you re-opening the bleeder screw during the 1 hr this process took? that may set you back to starting over on the bleed process
Since it sat for a few weeks we started with pulling all the diesel from the tank and putting fresh diesel in. Then from step one with bleeding. Top of the filter bleed, then bleed screw, then to each injector nozzle.


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I'd stay with it for one more cycle. My 430 was horrible, the next 330 and 332 went smooth.

One injector end at a time loosened while cranking may help, a second person is needed as it needs to be closed at stopping.

Maybe nick4030 can chime in as you may have a real issue. I am still hopeful as I was successful after 2 battery charges on my 430 and that was the best yanmer I ever owned. Before and after.


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