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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is my first post here but I've gleaned a huge amount of knowledge from you guys.

JD 317 is my mower with the Onan engine.
I'm mowing my lawn when it just stops dead in it's tracks. Gas is fine, motor rotates. I think its electric in nature because of the abrupt stop. Also, there's no juice whatsoever when I turn the ignition key. No clicking sound from the starter, nothing. Battery is fine 12.7 volts on my meter. The seat cutoff switch is connected. Is there a fusable link somewhere that I haven't been able to find?

Thanks in advance.
Al Schirado
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
It's been a couple of days & I've tried to periodically start it with the same result. Zero. I've had this 317 for about 3 years with excellent results until last Thursday.

"Check your pto coil. Could be a short. If you read across the coil you should see 3.5 to 4.0 ohms +or-."
Kedric, I'm not sure where the pto coil is? Is it under the front pulley? Do I take off the pulley to be able to get a reading?

I suppose I could try bridging across the starter to see if there is juice being delivered there. That might tell me if it's the switch. But, would a corroded key switch cause a running engine to just quit?

TIA
Al
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Haddon,

What & where is the TDC module located. I have a printout from the John Deere parts catalog, but couldn't find it. I reassembled it this afternoon in prep for taking it into be repaired (IOW,replace parts until they stumble onto what's wrong) and tried the ignition one more time. I did get one contact going to the starter and then nothing again.

I read the thread you gave the link to, and now that my memory is jogged, I do remember the PTO cutting out a few times the last couple of mowing sessions. However the tinyurl link you gave is inactive. (http://tinyurl.com/4c475o)

Also, as long as I'm going into this thing, has anyone installed an aftermarket hour meter. It would be more comfortable than just SWAG's on upkeep & maintenence.
TIA
Al
 

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There is no TDC module on a 317. I would get a meter and the wiring diagram to see where I am loosing the 12 volt feed. Since it won't even crank I would suspect the ignition switch or circuit breaker. Make sure the PTO switch is off and the travel lever is in neutral.
 

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Al,

The PTO Coil is in the front of the tractor. If you take off the side of the engine compartment you should find a wire that runs past the engine block to the front. On my 314 it was black, could be another color on 317. There is a plug that connects the wires. Disconnect it and read the wire that connects to the PTO to ground. You will use your multimeter in the ohms setting.

Does this happen only when you are mowing and have the PTO engaded?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Kedric,
I only remember it happening (for sure) the last time I mowed. Then the front pto shut off once maybe twice but then started up again within seconds when I toggled the pto switch on & off. In three years it has never shut down totally like this.

Al
 

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Looking at the wiring diagram a bad PTO switch can also cause a no crank situation. Purple wire from sol terminal on ignition switch goes through neutral start switch to PTO switch to small terminal on starter solenoid, this circuit energizes the coil in the starter solenoid to turn on the starter when the key is in the start position.
PS I assume you have checked the battery terminals, ground connections, etc. and made sure all connections are clean and tight.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Vinnie,
I did check all the ground connections, battery terminals and connections first. Just in case something had vibrated loose.

I'll try removing the wires from the PTO switch and just hard wiring them together. Maybe that will track down the problem.
Al
 

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Allen.

I purchased a 318 a year ago. When I purchased it, it would only run for a few minutes then die similar to what you describe. For me I found that the circuit breaker had a corroded end on one of the leads, therefore causing a bad connection. I replaced the circuit breaker and put a new end on the lead, haven't had any problems since. On a 318 the breaker was beneath the battery. Maybe this could help.

Chris
 

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Since you have an open someplace here is what I would do:
- Remove the battery and battery tray to get at the stuff underneath. The following test are done with the battery disconnected.
- Use your meter on the ohms Rx1 scale since we are just looking for circuit continuity(closed circuit)
- Key switch OFF
- Check continuity between engine block and neg battery connector
- Check neg batt connector and tractor frame
- Check pos batt connector and terminal on solenoid that also has small red wire
- Check Pos batt connector and terminals on circuit breaker, both of them, red wires. Also check across the circuit breaker terminals. Circuit breaker is a small silver box with two terminal nuts on it
- Check pos batt terminal to batt terminal on back of ignition switch
- Turn key switch ON
- Check pos batt term to IGN(pink wire), acc (yellow wire) and reg (lt green wire) terminals of ignition switch
- Turn key switch to start and have someone hold it there for the following tests
- Check pos batt term to IGN, SOL (pink wire) and ACC terminals of ignition switch
- Check pos batt term to both sides of neutral start switch pink wires, then check to B&E (pink wires)terminals of PTO switch
- Finally check pos batt term to small terminal on solenoid with pink wire
What I am trying to do is walk you through the system a step at a time and all tests should indicate a closed circuit if circuit is good. If you can find a wiring diagram you will see what is going on. Good luck on your hunt.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
WOW, thanks Vinnie.
I checked all the circuits last nite & found some interesting things.
1. The circuit breaker has been bypassed, Continuity checked out ok on the breaker, someone just decided to bypass it. The hot line goes from the solenoid to the switch, via the ampmeter.

"Since you have an open someplace here is what I would do:
- Remove the battery and battery tray to get at the stuff underneath. The following test are done with the battery disconnected.
- Use your meter on the ohms Rx1 scale since we are just looking for circuit continuity(closed circuit)
- Key switch OFF
- Check continuity between engine block and neg battery connector...OK

- Check neg batt connector and tractor frame...OK

- Check pos batt connector and terminal on solenoid that also has small red wire...OK

- Check Pos batt connector and terminals on circuit breaker, both of them, red wires. Also check across the circuit breaker terminals. Circuit breaker is a small silver box with two terminal nuts on it...NO CIRCUIT BRAKER IN THE LINE

- Check pos batt terminal to batt terminal on back of ignition switch...OK

- Turn key switch ON
- Check pos batt term to IGN(pink wire), acc (yellow wire) and reg (lt green wire) terminals of ignition switch...OK

- Turn key switch to start and have someone hold it there for the following tests
- Check pos batt term to IGN, SOL (pink wire) and ACC terminals of ignition switch...OK

- Check pos batt term to both sides of neutral start switch pink wires, then check to B&E (pink wires)terminals of PTO switch...OK on the neutral start switch, but the B&E (pink) wires-nothing. On the switch terminal post I got continuity.

- Finally check pos batt term to small terminal on solenoid with pink wire}...OK

}
Does this hint of anything?

Thanks again,
Al
 

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Looks like the PTO switch is bad. With the switch disconnected from the tractor wiring you should have:
- Switch OFF; B-E and C-A should measure closed all others open
- Switch ON; C-D closed all others open

Also as previously suggested check your PTO coil to make sure a bad coil didn't take the switch out. The jumped out breaker may be an indication of an overcurrent problem here or in the wiring someplace.

Have you had the battery tested with a load to make sure it is good, I have had batteries measure 12.5 volts open circuit but fall to 2 volts under load.

I would get a new circuit breaker and put it in to prevent a case of smoked Deere and much unhappiness. The battery can deliver 400 amps + into a dead short.

It would be a good idea to purchase the service manual CD from JD, about $50.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Vinnie,
I owe you a Beer, several in fact. It was the PTO switch. I switched it out, reassembled and cranked it right up.

I took your advice & ordered the shop CD for the 317.

Now I just need to change the circuit breaker and retine my tiller and I'm back in business.

Thanks again!!!!!!!!1

Al
 
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