JD 56 Engine
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Warren having done many engine swaps in older JDs even I can't help you with this one. What was the model and specification number for the original engine. With that I will do some research and see if I can help. Welcome to WFM. Roger
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The original would have been a V60 a 6 HP as in 56. A 57 used a 7 HP for example. Do you plan on mowing with this or is it a toy? The reason I ask is these were rear engine riders with not the best of transmissions or drive trains and for mowing purposes I see it being a money pit. I will do some engine checking and see what I can find out for sure. Roger
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Roger, Careful, you are on holy ground with a 56!! I bought mine new in 1972 and still use it for mowing every week in summer. The V60 was upgraded to a V70 which has since been re-sleeved to original. No problems with the transmission other than an external gear and chain replacements.
Warren, try this:
http://dalemaley.webs.com/savingthejohndeere57.htm<u>
and
http://www.wfmachines.com/55 56 57/model55 56 57.html</u>
I hope these links still work.
Warren, try this:
http://dalemaley.webs.com/savingthejohndeere57.htm<u>
and
http://www.wfmachines.com/55 56 57/model55 56 57.html</u>
I hope these links still work.
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309 Posts
Also try:
http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/17/103168.html?1155477229
My apologies. The last two links seems to be no longer available. The last link is a 56 upgraded with a Kawasaki engine by I Andrew Fuller if my facts are correct. Bob Tiarks pointed me to this story in 2008.
http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/17/103168.html?1155477229
My apologies. The last two links seems to be no longer available. The last link is a 56 upgraded with a Kawasaki engine by I Andrew Fuller if my facts are correct. Bob Tiarks pointed me to this story in 2008.
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10,708 Posts
David the last one with the Kawasaki doesn't work either. The first one did for me. The reason I cautioned him about that as a young mechanic I put a new engine in a Simplicity RER. I asked and questioned the fellow if everything else worked and he assured me it did. It was an easy swap of basically unbolting one 5 HP Briggs and putting in another. Got it finished and called him to come and get it. I think the total bill was about $100. When he came in I showed him how to start the new engine. It was a recoil start model. He got on it to drive out to his truck and guess what the transmission was no good. On further questioning he got a deal from a friend on the RER and assumed all else was fine because the engine on it had a broken rod. The transmission, some belts that were bad and a few other things added about $200 more to a rider that a good day then was worth $150. Roger
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309 Posts
Warren, Sorry about giving you two worthless links. I ran out of time last night.
If you search with "John Deere (Kawasaki)" you will get to this thread.
http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/335/103168.html
and a bit here as well
http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/335/417497.html
I hope this helps.
I guess it depends on how much you want to put into this machine. I had my engine rebuilt despite the fact that I was told the parts were no longer available. I found pistons and rings from sources through JustAnswer and I am still happy with my decision to overhaul. Bear in mind though that over here in South Africa we do not have the wide choice and at such low prices as you guys in the USA have.
Good luck with your decision!
If you search with "John Deere (Kawasaki)" you will get to this thread.
http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/335/103168.html
and a bit here as well
http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/335/417497.html
I hope this helps.
I guess it depends on how much you want to put into this machine. I had my engine rebuilt despite the fact that I was told the parts were no longer available. I found pistons and rings from sources through JustAnswer and I am still happy with my decision to overhaul. Bear in mind though that over here in South Africa we do not have the wide choice and at such low prices as you guys in the USA have.
Good luck with your decision!
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10,708 Posts
Don't forget more possible stress on the drive train and belts. 1 or 2 HP will not make much difference but if you go up to 10+ HP it could be a problem. If you want to get the engine to start you must almost always use a heavy flywheel engine. Rotary lawn mower engines use the blade for part of the flywheel effect. If you want to see the difference take the blade off a push lawn mower and try to start it. Roger
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10,708 Posts
Kawasaki's are great engines but have the most expensive replacement parts in the world. I have a JD 345 that uses an 18 HP twin and the needle and seat for the carburetor for example is $50. I have had very good luck buying engines from SEW in Indiana. I generally search through their list until I find an engine that will meet my needs. You can refine the search on their site by HP, crankshaft direction/ length, and a so on. SEW has engines by Briggs, Tecumseh. Honda. Subaru, Kawasaki and others. They also most of the time have dimensional drawing of the engines. The pictures are of an old 4 blade Jacobsen deck I did using a SEW Subaru pressure washer engine. The engine was $116 shipped to my door at their lowest rate. Since I live near Chicago that means the engines generally show up the next day. If you live further away it takes longer. The silver deck next to it is a Craftsmen labeled Jacobsen/Homelite Mulcher and the Briggs on it is also from SEW. Roger
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This is a SEW engine that might meet you needs but is a recoil start and only 6 HP. Roger http://smallenginewarehouse.com/product.asp?PN=FJ180V-CS11-R&desc=Kawasaki%20Engine%20%206hp%20Vertical%207/8%22x3-5/32%22%20Keyed%20Shaft,%20OHV,%20Recoil%20Start,%20Fuel%20Tank,%20Heavy%20Flywheel-No%20Brake
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309 Posts
Warren
Did you ever get further with your hunt for a replacement engine? Just curious to know.
Did you ever get further with your hunt for a replacement engine? Just curious to know.
Joined
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309 Posts
Well, more than a year later . . . .
Apologies for waffling on but I thought I should share this:
Encouraged by Andrew Fuller who in 2006 changed his John Deere 57 Riding Mower from a Tecumseh, to a 9/10hp Kawasaki engine (http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/335/103168.html ), and by Dale Maley who in 2008, converted his 7 horse to a 8 horsepower Tecumseh engine (http://dalemaley.webs.com/savingthejohndeere57.htm), I decided to bite the bullet and attempt a conversion myself. Dale detailed the issues around making the pulleys fit the one inch diameter crankshaft of the newer engine he used. The old one was 7/8 inch.
I bought my John Deere 56 Riding mower, serial number 35716, new in February 1972. Twelve years later, in 1984, I replaced the original 6 hp Tecumseh engine with a new 7 horse V70 Tecumseh. Since then, this engine had rings a few times. In late 2010, I had it re-sleeved back to standard and also fitted a new standard piston, conrod and rings. It subsequently turned out that this job was botched, probably because of clamping the head incorrectly and distorting it during machining. The cylinder measured out of round and was again re-sleeved by another machine shop, in December 2013. Around here, small engine shops are scarse and I had to use automotive type engineering shops.
Once a week, for about eight to nine months per year, I mow about a quarter acre of kikuyu lawn and with its gear drive and catcher bag, this John Deere 56, not only has given me excellent service, but suits my requirements to a “T”. My “ bigger toys”, a John Deere 140 and 317, are too cumbersome for my postage stamp sized property and they do not have materials handling (pickup, grass catcher) capability. I am not yet ready for a Murray, Snapper, or similar mower which, over here, goes for about $3,000.
Lately, the V70 became temperamental and at times it battled to start and would run uneven, or would die for no apparent reason. It could be points, condenser, or a carburettor issue. I decided that since the Tecumseh has more than earned its keep, I had to now seriously look for an alternative more modern engine.
Unfortunately, there are only a very small number of vertical shaft engines available here in South Africa which could possibly fit. In the end, the toss- up was between a Honda and a “Chinese Honda” with a “Magnum 8.5V” label. It is claimed to develop 8 ½ horsepower and for about US$200, it was a third of the Honda’s price. I also had more suitable dimensions and comes with a stepped 7/8 and one inch (22mm and 25.4mm) drive shaft.
The new “Magnum” arrived in a neat brown carton box, with no indication of country of origin, no user manual, no operator’s guide and no run-in instructions. Absolutely zero “paperwork”, other than two stickers on the plastic engine cover, recommending suitable oil and fuel grades.
Compared to the original Tecumseh, it has an all plastic engine shroud, plastic air intake unit, plastic flywheel fins and rather flimsy carburettor linkages. However, it has an overhead cam and pointless electronic ignition. It is also feather light on the starting rope, as if it has no compression. I bought it on recommendation of an acquaintance who has had good service out of this range, used as replacement motors for push mowers.
I had to drill three mounting holes for the motor, a hole for the relocated fuel tank and a hole for the modified and extended exhaust. The mower drive pulley’s sleeve was machined to 1 inch diameter for 20mm deep. I had to buy a new drive pulley with 1 inch plus collar and two 6mm half-moon shaft keys. Because it was a very tight fit and for heat dissipation, I moved the silencer box away from the engine and I had to fabricate a new exhaust pipe. Because the fuel tank was relocated I also had to buy a section of new fuel line. I also had to fit a longer throttle cable and modify the throttle linkage. The plastic fuel tank cover was cut and removed to accommodate the original engine cover and catcher bag arm. If need be, the mower can be changed back to its original form.
It is early days for this engine but so far it has performed well. It runs a bit faster than the Tecumseh and the unit is now a bit too fast in tight spaces but I can live with that. It seems to use less fuel and has no issues, so far.
I have no idea if this engine is available elsewhere and under what name. If you Google Magnum Engines the agents in South Africa, Magnum Power Products come up as well as engines for radio controlled stuff.
I do not think John Deere ever envisaged the 55/56/57 model range to last as long as mine did but I am very happy to have been able to extent its service, albeit with a “Chinese” motor, beyond 42 years!
Apologies for waffling on but I thought I should share this:
Encouraged by Andrew Fuller who in 2006 changed his John Deere 57 Riding Mower from a Tecumseh, to a 9/10hp Kawasaki engine (http://www.wfmachines.com/discus/messages/335/103168.html ), and by Dale Maley who in 2008, converted his 7 horse to a 8 horsepower Tecumseh engine (http://dalemaley.webs.com/savingthejohndeere57.htm), I decided to bite the bullet and attempt a conversion myself. Dale detailed the issues around making the pulleys fit the one inch diameter crankshaft of the newer engine he used. The old one was 7/8 inch.
I bought my John Deere 56 Riding mower, serial number 35716, new in February 1972. Twelve years later, in 1984, I replaced the original 6 hp Tecumseh engine with a new 7 horse V70 Tecumseh. Since then, this engine had rings a few times. In late 2010, I had it re-sleeved back to standard and also fitted a new standard piston, conrod and rings. It subsequently turned out that this job was botched, probably because of clamping the head incorrectly and distorting it during machining. The cylinder measured out of round and was again re-sleeved by another machine shop, in December 2013. Around here, small engine shops are scarse and I had to use automotive type engineering shops.
Once a week, for about eight to nine months per year, I mow about a quarter acre of kikuyu lawn and with its gear drive and catcher bag, this John Deere 56, not only has given me excellent service, but suits my requirements to a “T”. My “ bigger toys”, a John Deere 140 and 317, are too cumbersome for my postage stamp sized property and they do not have materials handling (pickup, grass catcher) capability. I am not yet ready for a Murray, Snapper, or similar mower which, over here, goes for about $3,000.
Lately, the V70 became temperamental and at times it battled to start and would run uneven, or would die for no apparent reason. It could be points, condenser, or a carburettor issue. I decided that since the Tecumseh has more than earned its keep, I had to now seriously look for an alternative more modern engine.
Unfortunately, there are only a very small number of vertical shaft engines available here in South Africa which could possibly fit. In the end, the toss- up was between a Honda and a “Chinese Honda” with a “Magnum 8.5V” label. It is claimed to develop 8 ½ horsepower and for about US$200, it was a third of the Honda’s price. I also had more suitable dimensions and comes with a stepped 7/8 and one inch (22mm and 25.4mm) drive shaft.
The new “Magnum” arrived in a neat brown carton box, with no indication of country of origin, no user manual, no operator’s guide and no run-in instructions. Absolutely zero “paperwork”, other than two stickers on the plastic engine cover, recommending suitable oil and fuel grades.
Compared to the original Tecumseh, it has an all plastic engine shroud, plastic air intake unit, plastic flywheel fins and rather flimsy carburettor linkages. However, it has an overhead cam and pointless electronic ignition. It is also feather light on the starting rope, as if it has no compression. I bought it on recommendation of an acquaintance who has had good service out of this range, used as replacement motors for push mowers.
I had to drill three mounting holes for the motor, a hole for the relocated fuel tank and a hole for the modified and extended exhaust. The mower drive pulley’s sleeve was machined to 1 inch diameter for 20mm deep. I had to buy a new drive pulley with 1 inch plus collar and two 6mm half-moon shaft keys. Because it was a very tight fit and for heat dissipation, I moved the silencer box away from the engine and I had to fabricate a new exhaust pipe. Because the fuel tank was relocated I also had to buy a section of new fuel line. I also had to fit a longer throttle cable and modify the throttle linkage. The plastic fuel tank cover was cut and removed to accommodate the original engine cover and catcher bag arm. If need be, the mower can be changed back to its original form.
It is early days for this engine but so far it has performed well. It runs a bit faster than the Tecumseh and the unit is now a bit too fast in tight spaces but I can live with that. It seems to use less fuel and has no issues, so far.
I have no idea if this engine is available elsewhere and under what name. If you Google Magnum Engines the agents in South Africa, Magnum Power Products come up as well as engines for radio controlled stuff.
I do not think John Deere ever envisaged the 55/56/57 model range to last as long as mine did but I am very happy to have been able to extent its service, albeit with a “Chinese” motor, beyond 42 years!
Joined
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309 Posts
Here are some pictures
Tecumseh - Top view
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Tecumseh LH view - Carburettor and Exhaust
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+++ jpeg +++ 302377 +++ Fist fitment try - Exhausting to the south +++
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Tecumseh - Top view
Tecumseh LH view - Carburettor and Exhaust
+++ jpeg +++ 302377 +++ Fist fitment try - Exhausting to the south +++
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309 Posts
For some reason, I presently cannot load more photos. I will try again later. "Upload Attachment" is not responding.
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