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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys, so I went ahead and installed a vanguard kit from Small Engine Warehouse. The B43G was tired so I wanted to get to a more reliable state. Anyway, install went great, no real issues. However, it will not turn over. The old engine would. I can jump the solenoid and it cranks. Applying 12v to the spade of the solenoid will crank. But will not crank with the key. This tractor has what looks like an ECM mounted to the steering shift. I am hearing from the SEW guys that it was added by JD for some sort of starting problem. Also, it has this circuit breaker attached to the solenoid. Not sure how to test it. Any suggestions?

Thanks!
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The circuit breaker? or the ECM?

The circuit breaker is easy, does it have power thru it, if so, it is most likely good. To test it for amperage load, you would need a circuit tester with some form of rheostat to slowly apply a load while measuring amperage, it would be easier and cheaper to just replace it.
 

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The "ECM" that you mentioned is the TDCM (Time Delay Control Module), it is a safety brain, getting inputs from various switches (safety switches). These are neutral switch (mounted on the ground speed lever), the seat switch (mounted either in the seat or the seat support frame), PTO switches (1/2 of switch is used for safety input), Brake switch (mounted to monitor the brake pedal position, added in late year production runs).

If anything happens to warrant a unsafe condition the power to the ignition system is cutoff. So you need to make sure you have power for the ignition (pink wire) and the starter solenoid (purple wire)

Do you have TM1590 for the tractor?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
The "ECM" that you mentioned is the TDCM (Time Delay Control Module), it is a safety brain, getting inputs from various switches (safety switches). These are neutral switch (mounted on the ground speed lever), the seat switch (mounted either in the seat or the seat support frame), PTO switches (1/2 of switch is used for safety input), Brake switch (mounted to monitor the brake pedal position, added in late year production runs).

If anything happens to warrant a unsafe condition the power to the ignition system is cutoff. So you need to make sure you have power for the ignition (pink wire) and the starter solenoid (purple wire)

Do you have TM1590 for the tractor?
Well, I do not have the TM, need to order that. I can confirm that the starter solenoid is good. I can jump it, and if I manually apply 12v, it turns over. I did suspect it for a minute till I realized it grounds through the body of the solenoid. Now, I am checking for 12v at the purple wire that supplies 12v to the solenoid and nothing. I test the neutral safety and it test out. This tractor does not have a seat safety. That leaves the switch itself, the pto safety and the TDCM. I have checked all physical connections and no issues there. So, can anyone suggest a next step or how to check these remaining parts? Thanks again to all for the assistance. Oh, one more hint, I had the key in run for a test and it started and ran fine when I applied 12v manually to the solenoid. Not sure if that suggests that any of the above are in working order or not.
 

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If your old engine started fine, I’m guessing something may have changed during the new engine install. Look for any missing ground wires or bad connections and repair them.

Trace your wiring to see where you lose 12V coming from the ignition switch and going to the starter solenoid.

The TDCM TimeDelayControlModule was installed on every 318 at the factory but a Starter Improvement Relay Kit is something that could have been added to your tractor ignition circuit later. That might be what SEW was referring to.
Look for a 1” square black box with wires. If you have one of those, it could be the starter improvement relay. The relay could be bad or there could be a loose wire.
Did you have to modify the ignition circuit or add a shutdown relay when you repowered?

Let us know what you find. Attaching photos always helps.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
If your old engine started fine, I’m guessing something may have changed during the new engine install. Look for any missing ground wires or bad connections and repair them.

Trace your wiring to see where you lose 12V coming from the ignition switch and going to the starter solenoid.

The TDCM TimeDelayControlModule was installed on every 318 at the factory but a Starter Improvement Relay Kit is something that could have been added to your tractor ignition circuit later. That might be what SEW was referring to.
Look for a 1” square black box with wires. If you have one of those, it could be the starter improvement relay. The relay could be bad or there could be a loose wire.
Did you have to modify the ignition circuit or add a shutdown relay when you repowered?

Let us know what you find. Attaching photos always helps.
Thanks Mike.

SEW didn't suggest any type of modifications. I do not find the starter improvement relay anywhere so unless it was on the old block, I don't have one. You suggest tracing 12v from the switch to the solenoid. Do you know where to check that? The switch itself has 6 posts. And it appears to then run into the TDCM. I am just not sure how or where to check.
 

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Note that power flows out of the ignition switch, into the safety switches and then back through the ignition switch again before it gets to the starter solenoid.
There is another version of this schematic that shows the transistor circuits inside the TDCM but you should not need it to troubleshoot your starter solenoid wiring and PTO switch and neutral safety switch and brake switch - if your tractor has a brake switch.
 

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I installed the SEW kit in my 318 w/o any problems, but I'd recommend to check continuity from the purple wire from the ignition sw when it's on, to the starter solenoid bellow the battery tray. You should have continuity at this point. Make sure the hydro lever is in neutral. After that from the solenoid to the started itself.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thanks to all who assisted and gave guidance. I was able to resolve the issue. There was a loopback type wire on the PTO, I suspect it may be a way to get around the safety which I will dig into, that had come loose in the process. New engine runs very well, I am very happy with it. Here is to many more hopefully trouble free years of service!!!
 

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That sounds like the jumper that is needed when there is no rear pto.
 
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Thanks for the feedback. Glad you found the issue. On the schematic I posted the link to, if you look about 1/3 of the way from the top and 1/3 of the way from the left, you will see that jumper located by X5. Without the jumper, the circuit is broken as if the PTO switch is turned on and no power will flow to the starter solenoid when you turn the ignition to Start.
 
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