[Hammerdown-7]

Hello Guy's
I had something Real Weird happen yesterday while Mowing with my 1983 John Deere 318 that has a rebuilt low hour engine in it. I restored the entire Tractor back in November of 2013. At that time I ordered a new built Onan P-218 engine for it that was built by Kustom Small Gas engine's of Minerva, Ohio. I was told by the engine builder that it had New Valves, Valve Guide's & New Valve seat's Placed in it as well as Valve seals, it is Bored 0.01" Over size and has had it's Crankshaft turned down 0.10" Placing new Piston's, ring's and all new Bearings & Gasket's as well as had all of it's flat surfaces milled down flat again which can be seen on the bottom of the block where the oil pan meet's the block, Indicating to me that I got a new fresh engine from top to Bottom at a cost of $1475.00. When it arrived, I Placed the new engine and a new hour meter and we used it all last summer to mow with, and it Never smoked or used any Oil all last Mowing season. Back when I Placed the new engine in it I broke it in with Three changes of diesel engine oil being DELO Brand of 15-40 weight and changed the Oil filter's each time that I dropped it during the Break in of the fresh engine. At 39 Hour's I dropped the diesel engine oil and Placed another new engine oil filter & then Placed some Pennzoil Platinum synthetic engine oil of 10-30 Weight.




Running it all last summer it never used any oil it has remained at the full level on the dip stick and it has Not smoked a bit. It now has Just 72 Hour's on it's new engine hour meter and been Worked weekly during our Long Nine month Mowing season to mow 2-Acre's of Grass per week as well as Till Four Vegetable garden's with it. with this synthetic engine oil in it, We have run it for it for the past 33 Hour's as I said, Not using any oil Nor smoking at all. I was half way done with Mowing the yard Yesterday and my wife called me to help her. I shut the Tractor off and it was sitting on the side of a Pretty steep embankment at about a 30 Degree angle leaning toward's the left hand side of the Tractor.




I came back to it and fired it up. The engine was still hot and the Throttle was set at the Half way Position, Once it started It let off a Huge blue smoke cloud that startled me. It cleared up quickly Not Missing a beat as far as performance goes it was running on both cylinder'a and sounded strong as it always' has so once it was clear, I drove it back to a level spot on the lawn, shut it off and checked it's engine oil and it was where it has always been being shown full on the dip stick, Not Over Full, Nor is it Dirty with Just 33 Hour's on it since I changed it last. I finished Mowing with it which was another Hour & a Half with no other Blue Oil smoking issues showing up again at W.O.T. or at an Idle. It now has me wondering just Why it let off this Huge Blue smoke cloud when I re-started it hot ? Will These Onan's smoke like that if they are Placed on a steep Incline like that Tilting the engine downward to the left hand side as I did yesterday ? When I was done Mowing with it I checked it's air breather and there is No Oil present there which would Indicate Possibly Piston Blow By, a Broken Oil ring which would not have allowed the engine to Stop Smoking or a Possible Plugged up Crankcase media filter, of which I placed a brand new one when I put the engine in. I am Confused at to what caused it to smoke just one time like That, has anyone else had an Experience like this with their Low hour P-218 Onan engine ? Regards, Kurt

 

[knottyrope]

might have been fuel from carb being hot, mine does that a lot and it burns oil too

yes on a big enough tilt the oil might be able to rest against the piston and allow it to smoke also

 

[lt230s]

Kurt,
30 degrees is a good tilt.
I've had that happen with single cylinder engines, especially push mowers. Tip the mower to remove string or other debris from blades and when put back down & start it, a smoke cloud appears. It clears after s few seconds. I think oil, being hot and thinner, gets by the ring gap into the cylinder and burns off when fired back up.
It has happened with older & new engines.
If it continues when parked on flat surface, you might look into it further. If not then don't worry about it.
John

 

[mrbeef]

Kurt as others have said I would think the incline caused the oil to be in the cylinder. Mine has done that a couple of times after I have had one side jacked up to work on it... not sure of the degrees but enough for me to get a set of jack stands underneath it.

 

[steve56a]

I pulled over a single cyl Honda engine running hydraulic power unit for our Jaws Of Life at the fire dept - salesman was wondering why there was a cloud of smoke from that area.

 

[jdmaninlouky]

Forget about it Kurt -

You have NO problem there .

Dave

 

[Hammerdown-7]

Hello Guy's
Thanks for all of the response here I Guess it is safe to say that I am a Bit of a Nervous Nelly when it comes to this engine after dumping close to Fifteen Hundred Buck's into it last Year I sure do not want anything serious to happen to it. I checked my engine oil again today after it sat and cooled off and it was down a touch not even a Sixteenth of an inch on the Dip stick so I gave it a splash of oil to bring it back to it's normal level spot on the dip stick. When I was done adding a splash of oil, I started it up and it is Not smoking at all. I have wondered if because this synthetic engine is is slicker than Snail snot if some may have passed by the Oil rings when she sat off Kilter yesterday ?


I have used Synthetic engine oil in all of my engine's for the past Fifteen year's and never had any issues as leak's or Heavy usage.I also have not had any of them wear out Piston ring's from hard usage or have any Internal part's weart in the case of my Dodge Truck it has not been touched internally since it was Bought New 15 Year ago. I know some will argue that the Price difference compared to regular dino oil is not worth it, but I currently have a Dodge Ram Pick-Up that is a 2000 Model that I bought in 1999 that has the Time Honored 318 V-8 in it that they no Longer make and I Dropped it's factory Oil at Just 43 Miles when I got it home that night and Placed Synthetic engine oil in it. It now has just shy of 200,000 Miles on it and has yet to leak or use much oil, and has No Valve Train Noise like I have heard on Other Mopar truck's with higher miles on them.




I Put 10.000 Miles on it between it's Oil changes and at Most it only drop's a Quarter of a Quart on it's dip stick, which to me is Nothing to worry about. I have noticed that by using synthetic engine oil my engine's seem to run cooler and hold a Higher Oil pressure when warm or worked until they are Hot. Last summer when we had a heat Index of 100 Degrees here in Knoxville, I used a digital Thermometer to check my Onan engine heat and it registered at 265 degree's On the Head's after Mowing with it. That to me is Hotter than a pepper Sprout and I feel a Lot better with synthetic engine oil in the pan of it that hold's a better oil pressure and seem's to keep the engine cooler. I do need to get that Blower Housing rubber Gasket Part that surround's the oil filter I did not know that there was such a thing until I read it on this forum, and it has to Help direct more forward air flow to the right cylinder head area with it in place. Regards, Kurt

 

[daverust]

You could remove the spark plugs one at a time and do a compression check if you are curious....if it were me I would run it and enjoy it. Who knows what evil lurks in the mind of these critters.

I have had them puff smoke, I have had a 4 cylinder fuel injected airplane engine miss a few time, never knew why, just as long as it kept on going. One cylinder misses and your heart jumps up under your chin.

 

[Hammerdown-7]

Hello Dave
I did do a Compression test last summer with just 39 Hour's on the engine to see what it had and it showed to be #125 Per cylinder and both were the same. It has Not smoked since so I feel that the steep angle is what caused this as the Synthetic engine oil had to make it past the rings sitting there some to make it smoke. I have since wondered if perhaps' The Pennzoil synthetic Platinum oil that I am using may be a Little thin as it is 10-30 Weight ? I checked the other day and you can not get any other synthetic oil heavier in weight than 10-30 as Oil companies are now making it lighter weight for fuel economy which is not all that good for an air cooled engine. I may Try some Shell Rotunda Diesel engine oil on my next oil change to see if that does better in the engine they sell that in 15-40 weight. I dropped the Delo Chevron brand Diesel engine oil that was of 15-40 weight after breaking in my engine at 39 Hour's and it has me wondering if perhaps' the ring's were not broke in fully at that Point ? I did order the Needed Oil filter gasket that fit's around the Oil filter and goes through the metal blower housing yesterday. it will be in today and I got one coming for my son in law's Fresh Built John Deere 316 as neither of our Onan's have that Oil Filter gasket on their engines. The Price was very reasonable from the Cummins-Onan dealer being Just $2.95 being Onan Part # 122-0502 so I surmise it will keep my engine Lot cooler with it in place and may cut any Oil consumption with the engine running cooler once it is on. I have some permatex weather strip adhesive that I will use on it to keep it Glued tightly to the blower housing once I place it. Regards, Kurt

 

[sreynolds]

Many use 10-30 oil in air cooled engines and or 5-30.

Nothing wrong with that.............

You are mowing grass, in April? I guess folks do that in TN. I'm not far from (canal town of)Minerva. The grass isn't growing here.Sometimes it is well into May when I begin to cut the lawn.

You mean it was bored .010" and crank was turned .010" right?

 

[332bill]

Kurt, try Rotella T6 full synthetic 5w-40. Good oil that you can use year-round. I use in both my 332 and 318.

Bill

 

[Hammerdown-7]

Hello Bill
I have had my eye on that Shell Rotunda T-6 but Noticed that it is 5-40 weight and wondered if it was too light weight to run in these Onan's ? I may try it next time I drop my Oil. Has your 318 used any of it due to it being a 5-40 weight Oil ? Regards, Kurt

 

[dkarst]

Kurt, I know you're working hard to take good care of that rebuilt Onan (I have 318 as well). I've been using Amsoil small engine oil that is full synthetic and meets BOTH ratings, 10W-30 and SAE 30. Made for high temp air cooled engines. A little expensive but not too bad.

 

[332bill]

Kurt, I haven't noticed any higher oil use with the 5w-40. I Have used the Amsoil oil too. Rotella is just easier to get and I use it in multiple vehicles (Turbo diesel suburban) as well.

Bill

 

[Hammerdown-7]

Hello Bill
The reason i went with the Pennzoil Platinum synthetic engine oil is that it is one of the Leading engine oil's for High Shear strength. I found and article on engine Quaker State Defy engine oil where they tested it for shear strength as well as compared all of the current engine oil's offered out there & Pennzoil Ultra synthetic engine Oil was The Top oil for resisting Shear strength. I have used it in my Dodge Ram Pick up for the past ten thousand miles and it has not hardly used any between it's 10,000 Oil changes and I use it as well in my wife's 2012 KIA Soul and it has done well. Prior to that I was a Loyal Castrol Synthetic oil user but when they switched their oil to The Edge Brand synthetic oil they changed something in the formula and my Dodge Ram started to have some Camshaft Lifter noise as soon as I changed it. I called the Castrol Tech line and they felt that due to my Truck having almost 200,000 Miles on it that it's engine was wore out. I did Not believe that for a minute as it never had any engine noise until I Placed that Castrol Edge in it


I went down to Wal-Mart and bought a Jug of the Pennzoil Platinum synthetic engine oil and dropped the Fresh Castrol Edge out of my Truck replacing it with Pennzoil Platinum oil and the Lifter noise was gone and has Not come back since. I later Learned from the manager of our Advance auto store that Castrol recalled all of the Edge engine oil as it was missing one of it's wear additives so I was glad that I got it out of my engine before it did some serious damage. Here is a Link to That article about what Oil's tested highest for shear strength I found it to be a Great article and I was surprised to see that many of the Leading selling synthetic engine oil's out there did Not show to have great shear strength or are what they are advertised to be. Here is that article I spoke of it is Rather Sobering to see how well or How Bad these current engine oil's faired. It is a long Read and to me about all you will Ever Need to know about what engine oil to use or Trust in your engine for the best Protection and the Long Haul of a Happy Engine. Regards, Kurt

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c3-tech-performance/3078239-quaker-state-s-new-defy-motor-oil-lab-test-and-wear-test-data.html

 

[sreynolds]

There are a few specialty oil companies out there that are supposed to be above the others in terms of quality; Amzoil, Cenpeco,Lucas and Schaeffer.

It is interesting to conduct the "customer conducted" test with the roller bearing and see for yourself which of the name-brand oils function best. You can see them set up at trade shows all over America.

 

[akaothermick]

Hello Kurt, that's a good read, my humble opinion is clean oil is best, oil changes are very important, at least as much as oil quality,

 

[Hammerdown-7]

Hello Guy's
I really liked the Oil shear strength Oil Link that I provided in my earlier response as it is Not a Biased opinion it is an actual test of all the Oil's and how they faired under Load stress. I keep my oil clean I never run it dark in color or to the state of being black that is Dangerous ground to me. I do not mind Paying Extra for something that work's and it is evident that the synthetic engine oil's do Much Better than conventional Oil's as the Test result's showed. There will always' be argument's of what Oil is best no matter who you speak with they are touchy to being Loyal to the brand that they Like or use, and that's fine with me as I prefer The Pennzoil brand of synthetic Oil as I feel if it is Good enough for Team Penske right out of the Bottle in their High RPM Indy Engines it surely will work fine in my Low RPM Onan engine. Regards, Kurt

 

[wmgeorge]

I honestly think we should be looking at oil for air cooled engines or diesel engines instead of liquid cooled automotive type engines.
I am using the Shell 15w-40 diesel oil in my old engine because it has the ZDP (sp)zinc wear additive that was removed from automotive oils.
Its my understanding the oil for air cooled motorcycle engines still have that additive.

The new oils are designed for fuel economy, not long engine life. Both times I have changed over older engines to synthetic oil they have developed leaks.
Kurt BTW racing engines are overhauled after each race, the oil and the engine they use only needs to last a short time.